HEFFNER: I'm Alexander Heffner, your host on The Open Mind.

to women, to black people.

the fact that the state trusts us to do that means really, I think demands that it has this process have people who are not repeat players in the idea of the jury from England, CHAKRAVARTI: I mean it's in the constitution.

constitutional basis.

structures so much of how we make laws, What does that look like?

And I think we can get it in a couple of different ways.

service can be worked into those things.

one part of the way that you influence who gets the jury system.

identify as perhaps the most significant flaw still in the jury system today, decide who they want to prevent from serving on the jury.

And as a result they can get twelve angry white men, not women, not men of color.

What is the status right now of what is allowable perceive to be the biases that are going to favor in the process.

they can use on any of the jurors.

last term, Flowers v. Mississippi, from a case where the defendant was black, this is a problem.

Batson Hearing where the, It can be, they can be strong responses, And that is what results in juries that don't rid of peremptory strikes.

whether someone is able to serve as an unbiased and biased juror.

And if a lawyer, you know, says, defense attorneys are open to and feel like I the communities that drawn from.

value in striving for an intellectually diverse group of men, women -- And I think there's kind of two other things we can DMV lists and voter registration lists.

and the jury pool should be drawn from that list.

You know ancient Athens had, in Athens was day two, they paid people a daily some states offer, you know, who are losing out on salary by coming to jury duty.

HEFFNER: And some, some employers would not -- to live if they, if they are asked to serve on a jury.

called and who gets selected?

And that also the people who are really concerned I mean I also think there needs to be a change on love television shows about crimes, HEFFNER: More during the case.

more people, the idea is not having the time to do it citizens who actually do serve on a jury.

question of radical enfranchisement to be are not sufficiently involved in day-to-day influence to lobbyists and are not generally represented in the way that the Athenians hoped.

And maybe not laziness, pick a word, democracy because serving on a jury is the most something that can be emulated?

allows significant time for education on the within the structure of the trial.

let's say that give citizens you know, feeling frustrated that like, When they're given the time, just be overwritten by, you know, by the what's going on in the room in which folks are you know, here are the hours during which we're deliberating.

about is, in the same breath of transparency and participatory democracy is, and you know, for one thing you could get a allocation of, you know, here's what you paid and here's what it went towards.

CHAKRAVARTI: That's an interesting point.

general over many decades.

electorate, which, which we haven't really done.

some ways that we need the kind of money breakdown, That we have, you can get data on so many different things, right now in the American system where the versus every other human service,